Why Bash our cars?

[whitewolf]

How come the guys on Rennlist are always bashing Chevy conversions? They should be glad to see our cars going to the next level :)

[v8carreragts]

I think they don't like a non Porsche engine in our cars but most importantly, they are jealous! There is no way that they can get the HP, torque and reliability out of their motors.

[whitewolf]

the thing is the 924 / 944's came with Audi engines in the first place!

[v8carreragts]

Well, that isn't correct. The early 924 came with an engine built by AUDI but designed by Mercedes Benz and the late 924 & all 944's came with a genuine Porsche engine that was taylored from the 928.

[whitewolf]

my 1984 944 had tons of audi stamps on it. the tranny too.

[Vonov]

The 944 transaxle is an Audi design. As much as the Porsche purists like to ignore the fact, many of the generic parts (window motors, etc) come straight out of the VW/Audi parts warehouses.
I've caught flak over the VR6 swap I'm doing...and the damn VR6 is the same (larger displacement) design as the 3.2 base Cayenne motor. It's basically an engine that just hadn't made it into a Porsche yet at the time it was originally designed and built... Sheesh...

[powaw]

yea, it's just jealousy. Alot of them are getting spanked by newer grocery getters and aren't capable of making improvements to the cars themselves. They're only response then is sell it and buy something faster instead of customizing. I like to think that we are saving a few of these cars by making them desirable again. It does suck though because you get shunned by most Porsche owners because it's not a 911, and then again by the people who own the same car because you've modded it. I've found it nicer to hang with non porsche owners, at least they like the car.

[originalspaceman]

I've found it nicer to hang with non porsche owners, at least they like the car.

That's exactly what you need to do. The only 2 porsche guys I hang with own a 914 and a 944. The guy with the 914 loves my car. The 944 guy accepts it, but isn't enthusiastic about it. If I'm out cruising the town for any reason I go find the chevy guys, the really high-end "ricer" guys (the ones with actually fast cars). Occasionally I hang with the muscle car guys, but only the ones that worked on their own car. They go ape-shit excited when they see my car. I guess that's the real trick. Find the guys that work on their own cars. They may be ricers, f-body, muscle car, or even truck guys. They're probably cool and they'll probably like your car.

[powaw]

Wait until you race your car against the real porsches and beat them, that will make them like you even more...wait, maybe it won't hehe. The audi guys seem to get a kick out of us putting 20vt's and 7a's into our cars, you could hang with them also. The difference is people who buy fast cars and people who make them.

[Turbobrat930]

I also feel that there is another reason why they bash the swappers.... Have you seen the quality of some of the swaps out there?? I mean come on,,,really?? I feel that if you are not going to do it right, then don't do it at all. Wires duct-taped all over the place. Round holes cut through the hood in order to fit the round Edelbrock or Holley air cleaner through. Enough hose clamps to sink a ship. Color wire loom everywhere. I mean come on.... enough is enough. I think that the so called "purists" are thinking of these few "swaps gone wrong" and putting a label on every swap.

Kudos to the swaps that are done in good taste. The swappers that made it look like the engine " came from the factory that way". Swaps that if you raise the hood, most people will come over and say, "wow, nice job". That is the level each of us need to subscribe to. Now I know that most can not afford a new or even new LSX series engine...maybe not even a LT series engine. But to put 100 hose clamps on a car that only requires 20 is just wrong. To cut a HUGE hole in the hood to fit that nice chrome air cleaner, instead of fabbing up a CAI that would look nice, and fit under the stock hood.

I am sorry guys, but we have done some of this ourselves... and only "we" can undo it. If you undertake a swap... DO IT RIGHT!!!!! Dont jerry-rig it!!!!!

And if you start one of these projects with the goal of winning over the "purists" then you might as well stop before you begin. That is what this should not be about. It should be about making a 944 car better. It should be about taking the anemic N/A engine out and replacing it with a higher performance engine that gives you 3 to 4 times the HP , and will cost a whole heap less to fix if something does go wrong....

My.02 worth!!!

[craighardy]

I also feel that there is another reason why they bash the swappers.... Have you seen the quality of some of the swaps out there?? I mean come on,,,really?? I feel that if you are not going to do it right, then don't do it at all. Wires duct-taped all over the place. Round holes cut through the hood in order to fit the round Edelbrock or Holley air cleaner through. Enough hose clamps to sink a ship. Color wire loom everywhere. I mean come on.... enough is enough. I think that the so called "purists" are thinking of these few "swaps gone wrong" and putting a label on every swap.

I couldn't have said it better. I agree 100%!!!

Do you own a conversion?

[powaw]

great points, I found a 944 locally with the lt1 in it for 3500 dollars, but like you said it was such a hack job that I passed. It still had a one wheel peel n/a tranny in it. There is alot to be said for fit and finish on any modded vehicle.

[Turbobrat930]

Do you own a conversion?

LOL, nope, but I am just starting mine.... You might need to sit down... I have been known to go WAY overboard on my vehicles....

I recently rebuilt my 930 engine.... while the crankcase was apart, I hand polished both the outside and inside of the case.. I have about 160 to 180 hours just in polishing!!!! But boy, the engine looks awesome!!!!

This project will be no different... I have a 86 944. And I just bought a 05 LS2 from a Vette with 48,000 miles... Now to get ahold of Xschop..and a few others.... this is going to be fun!!!! PORH!!!!

[craighardy]

Sounds great! You should setup a gallery.

[Vonov]

Amen, brother, amen...that is precisely the reason I am taking my time with my VR6 swap...and if I have to cut the hood because of the height of the block (hoping I don't) I will at least cover it, before anyone sees it, with a molded-in cowl induction bulge. The idea is, as you said, to make it look factory...If you want to see the kind of detail that makes people change their mind about a swap, go to Pennock's Fiero Forum, and check out Skitime's work...to give you an idea, Skitime swapped in a 3800 SC into his Fiero...he didn't like the look of all the steel fuel line crisscrossing back and forth over the supercharger, so he rerouted everything, including the wiring for all the sensors, and repainted the supercharger to match the rest of the car. THEN he 'glassed in a plexiglas window in the decklid above the SC, and installed amber lights to illuminate it at night (It kinda looks like there might be a nuclear reactor in there; it's sorta spooky lookin, lol). Not being content with that, he refinished the UNDERSIDE of the decklid so that the entire installation looked like it came off the showroom floor that way just last week. Needless to say, the rest of the entire car is just as immaculate. I just wish he owned a 944, lol...I'd really like to see what he'd do with it.
EDIT: Another bit of detail I'd forgotten was his headlight cover mod...he cut out the lettering in the headlight cover, filled in the lettering with acrylic resin, and then illuminated it from the underside. The entire build can be found on Pennock's under "A History of Skitime's Car"

[ChadTanner]

Your right about Pennocks,most people would not believe without seeing!!I have to say,that has always been my favorite automotive forum.I've never owned a fiero or really so much wanted one.For me,The forum is not about the car,It's about the amazing people and the amazing things they have accomplished.

Thanks...
Chad

[Turbobrat930]

I am not really into Fieros either, but can appreciate a good conversion... I will have to look at his car on the web. There are some people out there with some AWESOME skills ....and they dont even work for RH..LOL

[Turbobrat930]

Sounds great! You should setup a gallery.


Thanks Craig... I just did...added a few pics of the engine....

[damian]

Porsche and VW/Audi were WAY tight back in the 944 days. There are lots and lots of parts on the 944 that come straight from the VW parts bin. Door handles, locks, steering column, turn signal stalks, and a million other parts. The Audi Coupe was actually going to be a Porsche until they scraped it and Audi picked it up. Porsche went with the 924/944 instead.

VW and Porsche have always been tight - especially in VW's aircooled days. Go check out how much 914/944 parts the classic Beetle guys like to use! VW went watercooled by buying Audi and using their technology. This had the effect of getting Audi's technology closer to Porsche.

If you really want to piss off the purists remind them that the current lineup of Porsche owes a LOT to Toyota! Porsche contracted with them to help Porsche be profitable. One of the direct results was the Boxster. (which, for some strange reason, looks a lot like the MR2 spyder....)

At the end of the day who really cares? If it's good stuff that's all that matters.

Ok - rant is over!

Damian